Scordis (Arapis)/Papapanagiotou

[Administrator]

A new member, Vanessa, wrote as follows:

hi, i'm a new member and all i have time to write is that my late grandmother's name was Paraskevi Scorde (or Scordis) and was born to Despina Papapanaioti of Castallorizo who married Emanual Scordis of Simi. They came to Australia in about 1918 and i think Despina (My great grandmother) was born in 1889. I don't know any further back than this at this stage but would love to know if anyone else does! Thanks, Vanessa

While I have not yet found any reference to your great grandparents' marriage in the dowry archive, I have noticed that there are at least 3 files concerning their arrival in Australia in c. 1918 held by National Archives.

If you go to www.naa.gov.au and search their collection under 'Scordis' you will see the file references come up under 'Manuel' and 'Despina'. You can order copies or have the files digitised for public access. They should give you a lot of new information about the circumstances of their arrival here.

Do you know if they married on Castellorizo? If so, when? Any further details on their marriage will hopefully assist me to uncover more information from other sources.

Nicholas

[Vanessa Maladakis]

Hi Nicholas,
Thankyou so much! I will find out as much as I can about their marriage...not sure if it was in Simi or Castellorizo.
You are amazing and so is this sight!
Vanessa

.....ps not sure if you got this message twice ..sorry

[vanessa]

Nicholas,
My great grandparents were married on Castellorizo in about 1915 or 1916...hope you can find something!
Thanks, Vanessa

[Administrator]

Vanessa,

Unfortunately, the dowry contracts for the 1915-1916 period are incomplete. It appears that the tumult on the island during this time led to some poor record keeping in the local council because there is a void from January 1915 to February 1916.

Nevertheless, I do have access to a separate log of weddings for this period that was kept by the priest Theodosios Simonides as the island's then senior cleric. I am pleased to tell you that your great grandparents' wedding is noted in the following terms:

No.5/167 In accordance with the written guarantee of the parish priest dated 24 April 1915, permission was granted for the marriage ceremony of Emmanuel Yeorgiou Arapis and Despina Papapanagiotou, both of whom enter marriage for the first time.

24 April 1915,
Castellorizo,
The Episcopal Guardian
Head Priest Theodosios Simonides

You will note the different surname for your great grandfather. It was not unusual when someone arrived on the island from another place for them to be given a nickname, and for that name over time to supplant the 'true' surname of the individual concerned. Do you have any knowledge of the surname 'Arapis'?

By the way, there is a Christina Yeorgiou Arapi who married a Kyriakos Christou in October 1914. Your great grandfather (the bride's brother) is the signatory for his sister in the absence of their father who has already passed away.

I hope this is all of interest to you.

Nicholas

[vanessa]

Thankyou Nicholas,
It seems my Aunt Athena may have (the original?) copy of the dowry...could this be possible? anyway i will certainly find out in the next few days as it may be another document entirely!
I will also endeavor to find out all i can on the name 'Arapis'.
My grandfather, who married the daughter of Manolis and Despina, was also from Simi with the name 'Afaras' and we are told this is some kind of nick name or otherwise 'unoriginal' name too. Have you heard of that name before?
Thankyou for all your efforts and i will see what i come up with.

[vanessa]

I found my grandfather was not from Simi he was from Asia Minor (?Tarsana?) so don't worry
about the 'Afaras' name.. unless you happen to know something!
More imortantly, my Aunt has a document that is from 1909.. quite a few years before the marriage of Despina and Emanuel, that states a certain property to go to Despina Papa-Panagioti and we think this might have been when her father died (a preist called Panagioti!)
Would this be the dowry certificate in advance somehow or just something like a will? I also found that Despina had sisters, one called Maria who married a Vasili Kazaglis and their son (my late grandmother's cousin) George , is still alive and well in Sydney. He had other brothers and sisters:- ?Afkelioti (they called him Jack), Katina and Peter.....Don't know if these Kazaglis' are same as others mentioned in other threads.

[Administrator]

Vanessa,

Tersannah, or Tarsanna, is the old Greek name for a small island in the Bay of Makri, to the west of Castellorizo (it now belongs to Turkey). The island featured in the offensives between the Turks and the French between 1916-1917.

It was not unusual for property to be conveyed to daughters, in advance of their marriage, upon the death of both their parents. This was usually done by way of a declaration or by will. If you would like me to look at the document you refer to, please do not hesitate to send me a copy privately.

And, yes, Vasilios Afkouliotou Kazaglis married Despina's sister, Maria Papapanagiotou, on 13 January 1908.

Nicholas

[fredfrance]

In reading your post, I see the name of KAZAGLIS. Your grandfather Vasilios Afkouliotou KAZAGLIS is it to the same family as my great grandmother Chryssafena K. KAZAGLI born in 1885?
That would be amazing! ! !
Frederique MOUGLALIS (France)

[vanessa]

Dear Nicholas,
It seems the name 'Arapis' is known to my mum and aunts. My grandmother had told them they called her father this because he had such a dark complexion like an 'Arab'!

[Administrator]

Vanessa,

Thank you for the fascinating documents you kindly posted to me. I have sent you a private e-mail about them.

Rgds,
Nicholas

[vanessa]

Nicholas,

Thankyou for your email. I will attempt to find the rest of that wedding photo but I think if there was any more to it , it would have been copied whole to start with. Give me a few days and I'll ask the aunties!

Vanessa.

[vanessa]

Nicholas,

Sorry, no such luck with the wedding photo. No one has ever seen any more of it than that.
Perhaps it's with relatives in Queensland but I'm not sure that anyone is in contact with them now. ( My great uncle George's family .. my late grandmother's brother's family!)........
Or even perhaps Melbourne with Great Aunty Mina's family .

So i guess it still may turn up down the line!

Vanessa.

[Administrator]

Vanessa,

I have checked my records regarding the young child in the wedding portrait of Emmanuel and Despina.

I was told back in April 2001 by Dorothy Stavropoulos (nee Afaras) that the child is Despina's niece, Katina Kazagli (later Passari), the daughter of Vasilios Afkouliotou Kazaglis and Maria Papapanagiotou. Not sure of this is correct, but thought you should know...

Nicholas

[cressie]

Hi Vanessa

I have a lot of Aussie records and have been attempting to piece together your Scordis/Afaras family in Australia. You most likely know already much of the info I have located re the family in Port Pirie SA and that Emmanuel Scordis had a brother, John, who married Evangelia Magriplis in Port Pirie. Your George Scordis was born on 27 Dec 1919 in Port Pirie and the family moved to NSW. I have found quite a few births, marriages and deaths in both states. Your family has links to Cazzie families and names like Nittis, Phillipou and Magriplis so that is why I am checking.

I have a couple of queires which you may have the answer for. Perhaps when you have time you may like to email me privately at [e-mail]

The biggest query is that there is a Peter Scordis born in Port Pirie on 21 Nov 1922 whose parents are Mick Scordis and Despina (nee Asinina) and I suspect they must link somehow to your family.

Best wishes
Allan (Agapitos) Cresswell

[vanessa]

Hi Nicholas and Allen,
Sorry to take so long... I've had a lot on my plate the last couple
of months.
1st- Nicholas, Dorothy is my mum! She may have been convinced by her sister (who forwarded the photo to you) that it was Katina but she definitely remembers her mum and grandma saying otherwise.... I guess we may never know for sure.

2nd- Allen, thanks so much for all your hard work. It really is appreciated and i will definitely look into the 'Peter Scordis' with the family as soon as i am able. Is he still alive?

Thanks again,
Vanessa